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heat transfer in pipe flow
Posted 9 giu 2010, 03:16 GMT-4 Fluid & Heat, Heat Transfer & Phase Change, Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) Version 4.2 23 Replies
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Try this heat transfer model by creating "Identity/Contact pair" between the solid and fluid surfaces and by giving "Continuity" Boundary condition for the pair, so that it transfers heat between the two surfaces.
Regards,
AndyT
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Very thanks for your interest. Then, how about the boundary conditions for individual two boundaries. Should both be heat flux having hinf and Tinf or covective flux or something else. The results obtained by creating a pair (I can not see identity/contact pair in Comsol 3.5, I just use create pairs in drawing mode) have some meaningful progress but not sufficient yet. Does your soln. includes the convective heat transfer in radial direction between solid and fluid? It does not ask h and Tdif (Tdif is temp diff. between tube wall and fluid) in applying continuity condition.
Hi Ahmet,
Try this heat transfer model by creating "Identity/Contact pair" between the solid and fluid surfaces and by giving "Continuity" Boundary condition for the pair, so that it transfers heat between the two surfaces.
Regards,
AndyT
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You can try doing this way - Go to Pairs (Boundary Settings - Pairs) and apply Continuity Boundary Condition for the Pair. Then go to Boundaries (Boundary Settings - Boundaries), it will show you 2 individual boundaries of the pair, select one on the fluid side and apply Heat Flux BC (Boundary Condition) by specifying 'h' and 'Tinf' (this is the Bulk temp. of the fluid). Then select another one on the solid side and give the same conditions as before and also enable Highly Conductive layer for this.
Then Solve it, see if this works.
Regards,
AndyT
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This is meera , i am doing research on heat transfer in ceramic material when placed in center of microwave cavity (multimode cavity)
can you please help me in this topic.
Thanks
meera
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I am having a similar problem. I have a very simple set up with aluminum and water, the water is flowing and is hotter than the Al, so heat should be transferred to the Al through the boundary. However, no heat is passing through. I have tried making a contact pair between the two surfaces, however there is only one edge that can be selected (the Al and water interface falls on the same line). I then use heat continuity under the heat transfer mode. Can anyone help me so that I can get heat flowing to the Al??
Thank you!!
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I am trying to model a pipeline of length 11.6 km with a known dia and thickness of metal wall and insulation thickness. The idea is to find the cooling power of the insulation fixing the outside temperature in one case and using the winds in the second case. For that i created a 3d using 3 concentric cylinders. Is the geometry right?Do i need to specify a control volume also.The problem i am facing is that the subdomain settings is coming deactivated in the physics menu and its not even being shown in the model tree. The same is for the boundary settings. What is the mistake here?
I'll be really glad if you could help me with this!
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Hi Anhmet,
I have just seen the problem you had time ago,and i would like to know if you can help me.
Im working in something similar,a heated fluid inside a pipe.Joined to this pipe there are fins that transfer the heat to a phase change material.
i achieved to make the fluid flow but my problem is relationated with his temperature.I want the fluid to enter at 573K and transfer the heat to the rest,so the temperature at the beginning should not be the same that the one at the end due to the heat losses.Instead of that i have a fluid flow at constant temperature of 573K and i dont want that.
Did you achieve to do that in your model???Can you give any advice or suggestion,i would be really grateful!!!!
Best regards,
Carlos
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Try to set your "initial value 2" temp at 300[K] for the fluid, and keep the inlet boundary at your high temperature, then change your time stepping "range(0,50,1000)" to "0,1 2 5 10 20 range(50,50,1000)"
You will then see the temperature of the fluid change over the first 3-4 seconds, thereafter, with your flow, the fluid temperature will be almost constant. Check the BIOT value for the different parts of your model
--
Good luck
Ivar
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But that temperature change corresponds to the initial change temperature of the fluid(from 300K(initial value) to 573 K(temperature boundary condition)),isnt it?It should be like this at the beginning,may be,but after that,the temperature reached by the fluid should be less.,because its being heated by a "colder fluid"(not at 573K)
I mean,we can see how the initial fluid is heated until reach the maximum temperature but then,nothing happens,it remains at that temperature and it shouldnt be like this,isnt it?
Did i understand you???
Thank you for your time and for being helping me!!!
Best regards,
Carlos
ANOTHER THING:
I HAVE ALSO BEING SUGGESTED ABOUT USE "STEP FUNCTION"...WHAT DO YOU THINK???
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I believe you are getting fooled by the colors, you should chek the numerical values by integrating over the input and output, or make a temperature plot over the input/output boundaries
For the step function its often a good way to get a flow started, by ramping it gently with a continuous smooth function. But in your case, with a bundary mesh and a laminar inflow, I got the solver to converge quicly even without a step function, because you have a low flow rate
--
Good luck
Ivar
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Hi Ivar,
Do you think the temperature plot is wronga nd the temperatures already changes?How can i do temperature plot over the imput/output boundaries as you said to check it?Im desperate with this!
Tomorrow i will also try the step function,both for the tempearure and for the velocity.
With this function,the velocity and the temperature will vary from 0 to the desirable value in a period of time,and then they will change but not due to this function(the fluid will dicrease the temperature due to heat losses) ¿?
Im not sure what i will achieve with this function!
Thanks you Ivar,you are helping me a lot!!
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from my experience there are very few "bugs" in COMSOL, but its easy to give wrong or incorrect input in multiphysics simulations. Your temperature plots are correct, but the automatic scale and graphical rendering can give you wrong impression on surface plots.
You can add a line plot and select a line along the inlet, then choose to plot the temperature the inflow velocity and the product of the density rho, heat capacity Cp times the temperature T times the velocity and you get the power influx W/m^2. The same for the outlet, and you can compare easier on 1D plots. To combine the two plots, you need to project the results from the inlet onto the outlet. Or you define global variables
--
Good luck
Ivar
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Hi,
If i put the temperature in "intial value 2" at 493K,and the inlet temperature also at 493K,the temperature in the fins at the end of the simulation is different at the top than the tempearure fins at the bottom....so the fluid is loosing heat and is transferring less heat¿?but the tempearure fluid seems to be the same in all the pipe
I dont know what to think,you think is correct,but how can i do Comsol plot it right??
I attached the file
Attachments:
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I've run your simulation. It looks fine. See attached files. Animation shows how heat penetrates from water to aluminium and SS. Plot of average outflow temperature vs time shows that water loses heat.
Regards,
Andrzej
Attachments:
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That you for looking my model.
I dont understand.Looking at the plot Av-Out vs T,i see that the temperature of the fluid increases until 493K,so its not loosing heat,and in the other plot the entire pipe its at the same color.The fluid temperature at the end should be inferior than 493K,isnt it?
Could you explain me?
Thanks,
Best regards,
Carlos
AND HOW DID YOU DO THE OUTvsT PLOT??Thanks
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In the limit, when time tends to infinity, the temperature tends to 493K (inflow temp.) in all domains and the rate of heat transfer goes to 0. Under these conditions (steady state) the outflow temp. is equal to the inflow temp.
How to get the plot of average outflow temp. vs time?
Under the Results node right-click Derived Values. Choose Average > Line Average. Line Average window appears. Under Selection choose boundary 28. Click = icon (evaluate icon). In the Results window (right-bottom corner) click Plot icon.
Regards,
Andrzej
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Thank you very much for your answer,again!
Why do the domains tend to 493K if the intial value is 493K??They have a flow entering at 493K also,so at the beginning,the outflow temperature should be the same that the inlet temperature,but after the time simulation,it shouldnt be like that,the entering flow should have dicrease his temperature due to it has transferred heat to the rest.......SORRY for my clumsiness!!!!!I just want to simulate the heat transferred by a fluid that enters at that temperature...do you think is already achieved?
Why is not that reflected in the temperature plot???The fluid should have different colors(less temperature)at the end!!!
Sorry again,i hope to understand what you mean
Best regards,
Thank you for your time,really!!!
Carlos
CAN I DO A PLOT "OUTFLOW TEMPERATURE vs TIME" or it doesnt have sense?
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take a look, you have a flow of 0.5 m/s your device is only 0.45m long, then you look at the temperature after 50 seconds, the fluid has passed 100x the length of your device, that is why the fluid appear at more or less constant temperature. Try a stepping time much shorterr at the beginning like 0.1 0.5 1 2 seconds and you will see better effects. By the way have you checked your mesh size, time stepping, heat diffucivity and heat capaciyt time constants, and their coherence across your model ?. Chekc a book on the Biot number and the time constants for yout thermal analysis, as well as the fluid Renolds, Prandtl and Nusselt number, all these are also useful to check the validity of your model settings
--
Good luck
Ivar
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Why do the domains tend to 493K if the intial value is 493K??
CAN I DO A PLOT "OUTFLOW TEMPERATURE vs TIME" or it doesnt have sense?
Hi,
Initial temperature of Al+SS domains is 293K as you can see in Prueba Conjugate HT.mph.
Hot water of the constant temperature 493K flows into your system. All outer boundaries (exept inlet and outlet) are insulated. Therefore, the final temperature of all domains (H2O+Al+SS) must be 493K irrespective of the initial temperature.
Outflow temperature Tout is a function of the two variables: t (time) and x-coordinate. You can plot Tout vs t fixing x or
Tout vs x fixing t.
Regards,
Andrzej
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Hi Andrzej,
Today i made a 3D simulation with a fluid putting the same boundary condition(TEMPERATURE and INLET).The fluid looses temperature,so i think the design should be ok,as you said!
I will try to make the plots,i will tell you if i can!
Thank very much for your time!
Best regards,
Carlos
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Hi Ivar,
You were also right,the water looses temperature,i have seen it in a 3D simulation with the same boundary condition,but not in 2D.
Where can i check all these parameters??
Thank you very much for your time and help!!!
Best regards,
Carlos
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Ivar,is there any way to make a fluid flows in close circuit(self circulating)?I have a close circuit of pipes,one of the part of the circuit is exposed to heat flux and i would like to see the velocity,temperature..
Any suggestion?
Thanks,
Carlos
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